EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Printable Version
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EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Regina - 11-10-2011 04:07 PM
For what it's worth, EA has updated the Origin End User Licensing Agreement screencap here for (at least) European users attempting to bar them from filing lawsuits against EA.
Whether this clause has a legal leg to stand on or not is another story. There is quite a discussion about it here at reddit.com
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Pary - 11-10-2011 06:36 PM
EA's idiocy never fails to astound me, even though it shouldn't by now. But they still seem to come up with new and creative ways to give poeple "OMG" moments.
If only they pointed that creative thinking at their games instead of legal rubbish...
Quote:So if you AND EA waive all right for trial then does that mean you have just aquired the right to make pirated copies of all their games ??
This comment made me laugh though . It was the first thing that crossed my mind as well when I read the initial update to the EULA; that it almost reads as if you can't take them to court for their shady business practises, but that they're also waiving the right to any trials if you mess about illegally with their stuff.
Bit of a messed up statement actually, when you really think about it.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Regina - 11-11-2011 03:41 AM
I hadn't even thought of that! Yeah, EA is at the top of the list when it comes to messing things up and this wouldn't be the first time, either, that they apparently wrote a EULA without actually looking at laws governing the area they're covering with said EULA. :facepalm:
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Ghost - 11-11-2011 08:57 AM
But if you get the disc and have absolutely nothing to do with the Store anymore, you don't need Origin anyway. That's the Origin agreement, not the game's agreement.
Of course this is going to bite them in the tail with digital downloads to people who have decided to refuse to allow Origin to install. If you're worried about me suing over your cool stuff, that's a big warning sign not to get it.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Sookielee - 11-11-2011 09:09 AM
I thought EA's digital download versions of TS3 actually still contained Securom. I do remember right before TS3 was released that EA made an announcement that the disc version would not have that , but the digital version would. The main reason I remember so clearly is that announcement was what made me feel ok about buying TS3 to begin with. I actually waited a bit to see what the sim community verified or found before I bought it also.
After the fiasco with TS2 EP's and the hours it took us to get rid of that crap off our older PC, I was not about to jump into that den of snakes again. I did get some of the EP's and SP's that had Securom, but I also made sure to have a nocd mod too as that awful thing did not install till you actually ran the game.
My point to all this is if in fact EA is still using Securom in their digital downloads, no wonder they have that bit in the EULA. Writin_Reg can attest to the pains EA caused so many and the legal action that followed. EA might be trying to prevent a repeat in Europe of the legal issues they had here in the US.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Regina - 11-11-2011 01:30 PM
It's true, Ghost, that if a person never connects to the Sims 3 store or the official Exchange they don't need Origin at all for the Sims 3. EA makes many other games it's used for too. After I installed the Generations update and Pets I connected to the internet in my Sims 3 game and found options for setting up an entire Origins profile, connecting my game to Facebook (as if) and a bunch of other stuff I never knew existed. I do occasionally use the Sims 3 store, mainly for picking up freebies, and I'm pretty sure most Sims 3 players do. Then if we want to update our games through the launcher we need it. Granted, that is optional but how many people know that?
From what I understand TS3 isn't the only EA game with DLC, so anyone who plays any of the other games and wants to use DLC also needs to use Origin. (Every time I think about that I want to say "Hallowed are the Ori!")
Yes, after the TS2 SecuROM debacle, EA does have cause to worry about lawsuits. There was a huge number of people with bricked CD/DVD burners. (I didn't have trouble with it but I don't have any extra software for burning discs either--when I want to burn one [rarely] I just use whatever comes with Windows.) I think trying to get out of them through a clause in a EULA which may or may not be legal is stooping just about as low as any company could stoop. Speaking of the legalities, I would be VERY interested to see if it would stand up in court.
I'm also wondering how long it will be before they update the U.S. version of the EULA with that clause and if it would hold up here.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Sookielee - 11-11-2011 06:26 PM
Thing is if EA changes the EULA after they have released a game or something that can cause issues that warrant a lawsuit it will never stand up in court. That would be like putting up a caution wet floor sign after someone slipped and fell. Because Origins is used for all EA games, I am wondering what they changed about Origins itself that their legal department encouraged the change in the EULA.
Thinking about it, it could just be cya due to being able to link your facebook account to origins.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Writin_Reg - 11-14-2011 05:09 AM
(11-11-2011 06:26 PM)Sookielee Wrote: Thing is if EA changes the EULA after they have released a game or something that can cause issues that warrant a lawsuit it will never stand up in court. That would be like putting up a caution wet floor sign after someone slipped and fell. Because Origins is used for all EA games, I am wondering what they changed about Origins itself that their legal department encouraged the change in the EULA.
Hey guys, I have a few ideas rolling in my head and I am also wondering if it is just a coincidence but about 2 weeks ago that law office that handle our lawsuite against EA for the Securom debacle suddenly has taken to sending me Email - sort of like a newsletter of different things going on that his office is involved in - which is especially weird as I have not heard anything from that office since the agreement was made with them and the FTC and EA. The case of course was never officially closed though, it was allowed to remain open for a period of not less than 7 years in case EA violated the agreement - but I was under the assumption that our part in the matter was more or less null unless the case was ever re-opened. All in fine, right. So imagine my surprise to suddenly start getting emails from them nearly 3 years later. Granted they are not mentioning the case or EA, but the first email was just so I could confirm that was still my address. Of course I confirmed, and then I recieved that newsletter. Friday I got another one. it did mention if any of their present Video game clients had Steam games to notify their office for further details. Which I don't, so of course I did not notify them. Then this evening my computer tech son who does have a lot of Steam games told me there had been some accounts hacked and credit card info from a lot of steam players - so that sort of explained that note on the newsletter. But apparently this just happened, so I assume it has nothing to do with why this Girade Gibbs sudenly decided to let all of us part of the other law suite know we are still their clients, as I found out also that this newsletter they just send to clients of that law firm.
I have been trying to puzzle this out - why after 3 years - perhaps there is more to this than we know, but those lawyers are obviously keeping an eye on things. It would have nothing to do with Europe, that much I am sure and another law firm was supposed to handle the European end in Securom anyway - their laws are vastly different than ours. i knew from the onset of Origin that Origin would be a big problem with the Euro laws just by reading the Eula we signed in the beginning. There are a great number of no-no's in Europe their government will not allow no matter how many Eulas the users sign - like that spyware on Origin alone is enough to present problems. Europe does not mess around. In US they were just up against us and the tiny FTC but in Europe they are up against the government.
But yeah there are other things going on with Origin - like I don't tell CAW users to update Origin for no reason, or people wanting their launcher to work as Origin has the contract to make the launcher work right and now is the only way a borked launcher can be fixed. If the launcher isn't updated people won't be able to get the newest CAW, upload or download to not just the store but the exchange, your download history, a whole host of things and on top of it EA is talking about Origin also handling Support soon. If the crappy way they handled Pets is any indication, we are in for worse problems - like Darkmirage being charged 3 times and not getting his discount. They tried to tell me my bank had not paid for my pre-order when they had - even told me it wouldn't be shipped until my bank cleared - oddly the game was delivered like 2 hours after they said that. They had no tracking number of course as they said my account showed it hadn't been shipped - I preordered back in June no less, oh and i have a government Bank - the same one used by Congress. But my hubby went to UPS and found my tracking number anyway - his company is an local UPS drop off. So basically that place - Origin - is a bigger joke than EA's present live support. I was far from alone in the craziness as well. So something is definitely going on - it's just what I have no clue.
Also Origin did update again this week and the Eula has been changed, but it didn't seem anymore asinine than it was the last time they changed it.
I just know the lawyer thing is really making me wonder.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Sookielee - 11-14-2011 08:51 AM
Now that information adds a really interesting kink to the chain. I am not sure I believe in coincidences, especially if EA is in anyway involved.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Regina - 11-14-2011 01:25 PM
Yeah, Steam was hacked a few days ago--my son has a few Steam games that he's been given by people he knows mainly from the Minecraft community. Since those games were gifted to him there's no financial information on his Steam account and from what I read (unlike Sony, Steam did release information about the hacking right after it happened) there wasn't much information compromised in the hacking, but still. It looked to me like they have a pretty decent encryption system, in that the passwords are hashed then salted which adds a bunch of gibberish in case someone manages to get past the hashing. They don't have any evidence that the CC information was actually taken but better to be safe than sorry and keep an eye on activity.
It sounds like Origin is made up of a bunch of incompetents, doesn't it? You'd think at some point I'd quit being surprised by this kind of thing.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Writin_Reg - 11-15-2011 06:12 AM
Yeah, I have found out that EA and their Origin is becoming like veins in a body, snaking out all over the place including just about all of EA's partnerships are now tied into Origin and EA's servers. PopCap, Pogo, Big Fish, IWON Games, All their face book games including Sims social, Yahoo games - . Even Movie Studios like Lionshead in England are connected. I am trying to find where it stops and there doesn't seem to be an end except for Blizzard/Activision and a few smaller studios/publishers that EA could not get their grips into.
It's like Attilla the hun slowly crossing the world and pillaging and overtaking everything in it's wake. What gets me is the tricky way this is not part of their strictly EA public records on the stock pages and holdings - why because many of those holdings are not based out of the USA. So hear people think EA has a money problem. The jokes on us. They are making deals monthly and it seems Origin is their link. This is the very kind of company all those people are protesting about because no taxes get paid or income registered in this country and the company has Lord even knows what kind of actual income. They registered just over 4 billion this fiscal year - all that is traceable - but I would love to see what the real figures are.
I'd love to know how they get away with it, if I can trace down just what I have, anybody can - i would love to see what I can't track. But now we know why EA is so secretive about everything - which is even more peculiar with all the stuff i found without even trying hard.
You can see some of Origins connections by turning it on, then click the store, when you do that some things get added to the header which is free games and deals. Go to the free games - every single one of those games are EA owned - some are like the pogo games, some are the facebook, some are demos of things like Dragon Age, and a few of MMO's that I had no idea they owned - check through different things in Origin and it adds how you can play a lot of your other games besides EA through them - if you check far enough all those companies come back to EA. Some I knew, but no where did I know most of those.
Check this out for more possible shock value from G4-
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Writin_Reg - 11-15-2011 07:05 AM
It gets worse, read this.
EA is taking over the world. ON no. I find something new every five minutes on google. They already apparently had Dice, Mythic, Publish 73 and Rupture even with the EADM - well seem when they took over Rupture is why they got the fellow who designed and made Origin for them. He is from the UK. He does an interview about Origin on EA News.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Sookielee - 11-15-2011 07:58 AM
Reading all of that makes me glad that I planted my old fart cane in the ground and refused to jump onto the digital download bandwagon. If I loose a game, I want it to be because of my own stupidity, not due to a company thinking, your not active enough, delete. I have games that are over 10 yeas old that I still play and I am willing to bet that the games available today through Origins, won't be in 10 years, even if you bought and paid for them.
EA is trying so hard to get their claws into every market they can. Scarey part is they are succeeding and it is the end user that will pay the price. Laws here in the US can't keep up with what EA is doing and I would imagine that the lawyers are advising, well there is nothing on the books that says you can't, so go for it. With purchases being in a digital format, it seems that you don't actually "own" a copy of the game. I mean no matter what I did EA can't come into my home and take the discs that I have, but it seems that it is legal if your game is a digital download.
I am by no means a hardcore gamer. I can't abide by the mindless killing 99% of the games available focus on. I didn't even like Plant vs Zombies because the only thing you are to do is kill. I know it is suppose to be zombies, but still. Next thing you know there will be a game for toddlers that teaches them to count by killing something. I so miss the days of adventure games, like Myst or Sierra. Exploring, solving puzzles and finding what ever thing you need to build or repair something. No kill all you see to win. I want games where the journey is part of the reward, but alas those are very few and very far between.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Regina - 11-15-2011 01:31 PM
Even in disc format, you don't actually own a copy of the game, you just own the right to use it. The thoughts of only having a piece of software available through some type of download really scares me, though. I also want the disc in my hand. I won't download anything like that, not even music any more. I have several albums that I paid for and downloaded from various places on the internetz. When I got my new computer I moved them to it. Now the only ones I can play are what I downloaded from eMusic. All the others have validation stuff built in so I need to go back to the source and revalidate them in order to play them. That's just wrong. I paid for it so I had the legal right to listen to that music, not be locked out of it when I got a new computer.
RE: EA Updates Origin Licensing Agreement for EU Users - Writin_Reg - 11-15-2011 03:08 PM
I sort of blame that validation crap on Microsoft, even though we paid 169 dollars for the full install (without the book no less) for Windows 7, and it is the disk version, when my husband was rebuilding my pc and had to put Windows on my third Mobo, when I went to use it I was stopped and my hubby had to call Microsoft and get my license re-validated. What made me the angriest is the fact I had only owned my copy like 3 months, and had yet to use it technically. We had installed in on the computer I had then, but it never fully installed which made us realize there was a problem with the Motherboard (eventually anyway) so hubby order me a new MOBO. As luck would have it there was a problem with that mobo right out of the box, and of course you don't know till you get it all together, programmed etc - but that Mobo was killing processors, so finally we went the expense of an Asus Mobo and for the third time installed my one license only Windows 7 on that, and could not get it to activate. Seems Windows 7 has this little clause when you buy the full install Windows 7 that you can put it on a hundred pcs if you want, but you can only get one copy to activate with your key. Even broke the second system activated and they tried to tell me I had to pay another 89 dollars to get another license key. Try proving you do not have the thing on two pcs - finally my husband was able to satisfy them I was only using it on one pc - the original mobo and Harddrive no longer existed as the mobo was bad and killed both the brand new Harddrive and new processor. We lucked out because Tiger Direct gave them the information they needed that we had returned all that stuff and got our money back. But it took us over a week to get an Okay.
I was furious. If I paid 169 dollars for something I should not be expected to keep it on one pc for the rest of my life. So Regina if you think the cost of a music album gets you, try that on for size. I did not even have use of my pc that we had spent over a thousand dollars building it without an Operating system that would come on anyway.. Now that is BS as games or nothing else works without your Operating System and it is not right.
Imagine if game companies did that?
EA did try with their crappy Securom, and they still control how many pcs you can use the digital versions, but at least you can get your keys back if you take it off a pc and add a new one.
The electronic companies are getting more and more controlling. I never had to jump through hoops like that with any previous copies of Windows I bought and paid for. I can still put our copy of Windows XP Pro on any number of pcs I want to put it on and at most a phone call would reactivate it. So I cannot understand this nuttiness over Windows 7. I can just Imagine what will be entailed with their next OS.
I wonder if it is just a coincidence that Windows is an EA partner. They keep switching CEO's like models change clothes at a fashion show. I have been wondering about that CEO musical chairs those two have been playing since JR has been in Charge at EA for the last 5 years. I keep waiting for some kind of big take over or merging because history of EA when they take on an CEO from another company, eventually the ownership of that company follows. The only exception to that rule so far has been Microsoft and Nvidia. Yep they been doing a bit of swapping some lesser Officers and Engineers with Nvidia also.
I do know one thing - though getting back to the Origin thing - JR does very much want everything in digital format, but from what I am seeing in a lot of different interviews and being said at stock holders meetings, that does not necesarily mean you won't be able to get disk, but you will have to have Origin to get your games to work. They have already made it so the launcher can only be updated through Origin, without it updated you won't have use of the store, even eventually to get your content you already paid for at the store. They are periodically changing coding in the game - which has a big to do why we are getting certain eps when we are - as seems these eps are already basically made - just missing the "stuff" from what I hear, but because these invoke new coding, you can't download your stuff unless the launcher is updated by Origin. Right now simmers are able to get around it by keeping copies of the sims 3 pack, but if what many of us went through after the new coding from Pets was involved, all my content I had copies of did not work right and I was having all sorts of game problems like overnight on the same game I had been playing the night before I installed the Pets pre-patch - the one with all those mysterious fixes they never listed. Once I uninstalled all my content, redownloaded it all (took me 5 hours), wallah the same exact game played just dandy. Even my own houses I had in my library were borked. I had to go to my own sims page and redownload all my own houses to get them running right.
To give you an idea what the store stuff and my houses did, it felt like a world in testing with really bad routing problems with stuck sims all over the place when there was really no problem and it was in every single world i tried them in, even brand new starts. But redownloaded all my stuff from the store and from my sims page - did not do a thing to the worlds or save games - and suddenly the problem was gone.
I was using Origin as I have found even doing those things does not go well without it. But you can remove Origin - still - after you download everything as long as you don't want to add more stuff to your game or a world. I did see where that may be impossible to do soon though. So people may not be able to play the disks they bought without it if they do what it sounds like they are doing. I think this is why they are rewriting that Origin Eula. They are in trouble with it right this moment with Germany's laws and so far that new re-write did not help the situation.